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Post by hodgy on Oct 21, 2015 5:51:34 GMT
Having tried over the last week to get a Scottish trip off the ground to visit the Torridon region of the North West Highlands of Scotland and in particular to stay in a fantastic property on the Ben Damph Estate this led to an interesting discussion with the landowner of this 14,000 acre estate .
Being quite open and honest it was mentioned to me that mountain bikers pose a bit of a double edged sword for the estate ..while they want us from the point of view of selling us rooms and the tourist " dollar " ..we are also massively contributing towards the erosion of estate paths which are maintained at their own cost .
Biting my tongue a little bit because I firmly believe that we cause no more damage than a walking boot ( and it could be argued a lot less ..but that's another discussion for another debate ) .
I had to agree with this from the point of view that there has been a massive increase in terms of mountain biking in this area even from when I first tackled the trails back in 2010 ..a subsequent visit in 2012 and I was quite shocked at the condition of the Coulags to Annat trail and mentioned this to the group .
Even this year on my favourite trail in these parts Applecross to Kenmore there was a significant amount of erosion from my last visit in 2012 ..
The question asked of me is the subject of the poll above ...even though we enjoy fantastic rights of way in Scotland on a voluntary " honesty box " basis ..would you be prepared to contribute towards the upkeep of these trails ..or maybe in the future lose the right to use them due to their continued disrepair .
I for one would have no problem with this ...please though answer truthfully
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Post by beansontoast on Oct 21, 2015 6:54:38 GMT
If the trails were mountain bike specific trails - yes.
By the sounds of what you wrote above, the trails you talk about are 'mixed use' trails? In that case, why the hell should I pay to repair the damage caused by walkers, horses etc.
At Cannock Chase, we are used to being blamed for pretty much all damage that is caused. In truth, I'd guess that 99% of riders who visit the Chase use the marked trails. That leaves 1% using unmarked or 'cheeky' trails..... Yet we cause ALL the damage!? Bear in mind here that ALL HORSES AND WALKERS use unmarked trails.
When you get a group of a dozen or so horses and/or walkers using a path.. Can I, as a mountain bike rider, really be blamed for the damage?
I would and do help financially towards the maintenance and upkeep of the marked trails here even though I seldom use them and I have no problem with that. I would however have a big issue with giving money away to repair/maintain stuff we (mountain bikers) are not responsible for damaging.
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Post by hodgy on Oct 21, 2015 7:06:35 GMT
Ahh ..but we are and we do contribute towards trail erosion on bridleways not just in Scotland but down south too .
If you read the post fully then you will have noticed that I am also critical of the walking boot ..and to be fair I would also include them in terms of contributing towards the honesty box ...as you quite rightly say they are also massively responsible in terms of eroding these trails ..
Each to their own opinion ..and I value yours ..but to absolve mountain bikers of any blame ..well that just ain't true ...
I also would never like to see this as a compulsory fee ..but on private land such as the Ben Damph Estate ..why should it be down to the landowner ONLY to maintain and upkeep trails and paths which we all enjoy ..the end result being that due to lack of funds they fall into a state of such disrepair that they are impossible to use ..
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Post by beansontoast on Oct 21, 2015 7:12:04 GMT
I didn't absolve mountain bikers.
If EVERYBODY who use the mixed use trails pays their fair share then yes, I'd contribute.
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Post by Jimbo on Oct 21, 2015 7:19:46 GMT
I agree, if everyone paid then i would happily contribute but I would want to see the money spent on the paths etc. not on other things.
I voted £1 to £5 as i assume it's per visit
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Post by rossco832 on Oct 21, 2015 16:47:12 GMT
I'm in the if they made everyone do it then I'd do it campaign.
Walkers are in their own minds blameless for everything. Although if you seen the litter they all leave on Ben Nevis which is disgusting.
I put a few quid in the Nevis range honesty box every now and then they do a lot of work for mountain biking and only get revenue from downhill/red route and occasional cafe use
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Post by marsbarman on Oct 21, 2015 17:35:56 GMT
I'd pay between £1-5. That's what I'm paying at 90% of trail centres I visit and their trails are kept in good condition. Only time I'd have an issue is if one group of users were exempt.
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Post by hodgy on Oct 23, 2015 4:16:25 GMT
Interesting comments so far ..my own mindset is that I would probably chuck a few quid into an honesty box irrespective of who uses the trail ..more likely at the end of a ride than the beginning especially if I had a good time and there was a sign explaining how the money would be used ..
I see that as my small contribution to making sure that I have as good a time on my next visit and by way of a " thanks " ...in much the same way as you would leave a tip in a restaurant for good service ...but not everyone does ...
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Post by Euan on Oct 23, 2015 5:16:38 GMT
Nope, wouldn't pay anything unless the bike trails were separate from the other trails. Why should I have to pay every time I want to use my bike? I'll happily pay at trail centres but on natural stuff or mixed trails.... Not on your nelly! I could maybe understand if it was England with the rubbish access laws but not up here.
I don't see how the Landowner in the Ben Damph Estate (or any other land owner) could legally charge people, be it walkers, riders or Horse riders, is he/they going to turn his/their land into a venue and erect fences all around to stop people from entering? are they going to monitor all traffic coming on and off his land? |
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Post by hodgy on Oct 23, 2015 5:48:51 GMT
Euan ..I don't think that they are thinking along those lines at all ..
The discussion that I had was mainly about how due to the increase in traffic over the last few years the paths / trails on the estate had seen an increase in terms of erosion ..something which I have witnessed myself on subsequent visits ..and how that was putting a strain in terms of both cost and manpower on the estate itself to maintain these paths
I think we are slightly missing the point ..or maybe I haven't explained it properly ..this would NOT be a compulsory charge ..nor would it have to be every time you visit ..but on a voluntary basis and only if you wanted to ..in order to maintain these excellent trails would you be happy to put your hand in your pocket ...and contribute something ..
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